Jumbo's custom turbo build

I have been following this thread from day one, come to this point I really don't know what to say. Sorry man, but it will be better as you have fun and confidence with it....Head up bro.........
 
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Damn Sorry to here about that buddy....!! :eek.:

Guys.......am i reading this wrong......i thought i read a part of the OEM headers broke off.......so how could anyone forsee this.
So it was the OEM header that failed..........still not in the market for aftermarkets brad with now showing these can brake as well.

I´m still thinking of using my DC headers......but as oem Headers won´t last.......how would the DC´s do.
Is it possible to extra weld them on the outside just in case...?? Hmmm are coated also so that won't be easy as well i gues...................:confused:
 
jumbosrule said:
Engine power limits don't speak to the transmission. 600hp safe motor will still blow a stock transmission... or even a lightly built transmission. The choices I made for fuel delivery, turbo and wastegate/BOV were designed to max out the drivetrain with margin for safety. Guess what I am saying is that a JWT TT kit by itself can't compare to what I have done with the FX. But sure - $20K including a JWT would probably get you to pretty darn close race with my setup. Till that happens tho - only one of us has performance data. The other one of us is just guessing.
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I'm going to say this is an incorrect statement. I've posted plenty of performance info for a JWT TT and a built motor and a 5AT. My initial build costs 4 years ago was right about 15k for the built motor and JWT TT. Till your set up is more than dyno numbers, I'm going to say JWT is still more bang for buck and reliable at this point.

2 tenths back from a manual trans C6 corvette.
cal_speedway_210_run_6.jpg

track :: 100_1184.flv video by oc-rookie - Photobucket@@AMEPARAM@@http://vidmg.photobucket.com/player.swf?file=http://vidmg.photobucket.com/albums/v319/oc-rookie/FX/track/100_1184.flv@@AMEPARAM@@vidmg@@AMEPARAM@@mg@@AMEPARAM@@v319/oc-rookie/FX/track/100_1184
 
jumbosrule said:
... I'm not sorry I went custom but there was a lot of figuring things out and fixing small things that would have been addressed by a kit, saving all kinds of time and money. Knowing what I know now, I would recommend the JWT TT kit to anybody wanting to take the FX to Forced Induction.

But know this - if you go with a kit like that, my FX will spank yours. :cool:
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rookie said:
I'm going to say this is an incorrect statement. I've posted plenty of performance info for a JWT TT and a built motor and a 5AT. My initial build costs 4 years ago was right about 15k for the built motor and JWT TT. Till your set up is more than dyno numbers, I'm going to say JWT is still more bang for buck and reliable at this point.
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Even though you quoted my post, it was taken in the context of the above original statement, a few posts before. I completely agree the JWT would be more bang for the buck. In talking strict performance numbers I could probably make an argument for an STS kit too. Not quite as much power or reliable but not as expensive either. But the build as a whole - fit & finish counts bigger for me. An off the shelf kit packaged for the engine bay of the Z or G is a compromise (like an STS turbo kit). Not hating on the JWT but it was adapted for us, not made for us.

Totally fair for you to call me out on the numbers though. All I have is a dyno - and an obsolete one at that since my turbo is currently being re-ordered. Right now any NA on the street could smoke me.
 
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jumbosrule said:
That and going with a kit rather than a custom job. I'm not sorry I went custom but there was a lot of figuring things out and fixing small things that would have been addressed by a kit, saving all kinds of time and money. Knowing what I know now, I would recommend the JWT TT kit to anybody wanting to take the FX to Forced Induction.

But know this - if you go with a kit like that, my FX will spank yours.
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jbaker1121 said:
even with a fully built motor?
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do we have power numbers on yours yet
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jbaker1121 said:
sweet, I'll check it out.
I was just going by your claim: here's my $.02
20k including JWT+ engine build is about 600hp safe.
JWT kit with proper tune (9kish) is about 420 safe with no engine build....
just saying I'm not sure about the "spanking"
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edit: vid is sweet, nice powerband...Time for some lighter wheels
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I don't think I took it out of context. Read the exchange with jbaker before posting. Custom is cool, you can make up for lost efficiencies that are compromised in a "kit". But just because it is custom doesn't mean any deficiencies were corrected. Production kits can take into account a lot of things custom fabricators will have to do one step at a time. Depending on time, money, and knowledge an average fabricator is not going to going to out think seasoned engineers.

The draw thru maf of the JWT kit is probably the worst part of the kit in "looks". There are serious upsides to that draw thru maf though.

I'm sure the shop will get everything figured out. I am probably coming off like a dick, it's not my intention. No matter what I say or post, your FX is probably a blast to drive. :biggrin:
 
Visited the shop this afternoon.

The turbo failure was absolutely caused by the OEM exhaust manifold. They showed me the manifold and if you look into the center hole you can see to where the first tube meets the second. There is a chunk of metal very obviously missing - shaped almost exactly like the largest piece of debris they found - albeit with a few turbine vane marks on it. It was not a bad weld job from the shop.

Turns out that's not all.

I hit a paint can a few days before I lost boost and broke the bottom splash guard. Ended up just sourcing a new one. At the time, that's all I saw when I had the front of the car up on jack stands. Up on the rack, the guys showed me my front sway bar had an obvious dent and deflection in it. Bent it enough to cause the passenger side end link to pop off the ball end. We're sourcing a new sway bar and both front end links. While we are at it, we're getting the rear sway bar as well since it doesn't come on the FX35 RWD. Probably going to have to modify the Stillen exhaust (again) but at this point that seems like a small thing.

So it will be close to another thousand bucks once shop labor and install is completed.

We decided to use my old OEM headers after first having them scoped and inspected, then media blasted and ceramic coated if they check out. We're ordering a new turbine wheel and CRHA from Garrett - shop is covering that. All the other cooling goodies are still sitting on the shelf waiting.
 
wow man, that's good to hear, sorry I jumped to that conclusion, just that I've seen maybe a hundred pictures of turbo's looking exactly like yours that were virtually all caused by particle damage from bad welds, the chances of it being a factory part failure just did not seem so likely, as much as what happened sucks I'm real glad to see that it was not a blatant failure on the fabricators part.

any ideas as to why that did happen? I mean I guess the factory manifolds are not designed for the amount of heat that turbo's will make them reach, but I think they are stainless steel, strange for it to fail like that. aren't you concerned about reusing oem headers again?
 
StuLax18 said:
Did you think about maybe going to bigger sway bars, if some that fit are even available?
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Nothing's available. I guess the shop could fabricate a set, but since I'm adding the rear bar and already have the full set of GTSpec bracing, I'm thinking they'll be fine. It's not like other boosted FXs stress the sway bars to the point of bending that I have heard.

turbocad6 said:
wow man, that's good to hear, sorry I jumped to that conclusion, just that I've seen maybe a hundred pictures of turbo's looking exactly like yours that were virtually all caused by particle damage from bad welds, the chances of it being a factory part failure just did not seem so likely, as much as what happened sucks I'm real glad to see that it was not a blatant failure on the fabricators part.

any ideas as to why that did happen? I mean I guess the factory manifolds are not designed for the amount of heat that turbo's will make them reach, but I think they are stainless steel, strange for it to fail like that. aren't you concerned about reusing oem headers again?
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This was exactly the shop's reaction. None of those guys had seen this mode of failure before. So yes, I'm a little apprehensive about going back to the OEM manifolds but at the same time from the way the shop was talking about it, another failure would be like lightning striking twice. The only argument I can make is that these particular manifolds were used in a 550whp G35 application and so maybe they just got stressed/cycled? Not sure how long they were used.

John - outside of a complete custom fab, what other options do I have? Just go for a good set of headers?
 
jumbosrule said:
This was exactly the shop's reaction. None of those guys had seen this mode of failure before. So yes, I'm a little apprehensive about going back to the OEM manifolds but at the same time from the way the shop was talking about it, another failure would be like lightning striking twice. The only argument I can make is that these particular manifolds were used in a 550whp G35 application and so maybe they just got stressed/cycled? Not sure how long they were used.

John - outside of a complete custom fab, what other options do I have? Just go for a good set of headers?
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And were back to my doubting question again........would my Ceramic DC headers be able too handle this or would i need to look at other brand header. Friend of mine told me that it is prefered to have a 3mm ( 1/8 of an inch ) thick header for F/I or at least as thick as possible. I think my DC are half of that......so would that be enough :confused:

Quick other question jumbo, When do keeping the OEM MAF connected together with a MAP sensor and the Haltech.....would that be a problem you think or heard....??

Hope your projekt will be ready soon. Man i know how it is to be patienor have to be.....but when it's all done.......you will foget about all tha hassle fast :tup:
 
SexualChocolate said:
Why can't they fabricate an equal length, mandrel bent, tubular manifold for you? It will cost some cash, but it may be well worth it in the long haul if another failure occurs.
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I've requested a quote for that work - we'll see. I'd rather just buy something.

raymond said:
And were back to my doubting question again........would my Ceramic DC headers be able too handle this or would i need to look at other brand header. Friend of mine told me that it is preferred to have a 3mm ( 1/8 of an inch ) thick header for F/I or at least as thick as possible. I think my DC are half of that......so would that be enough :confused:

Quick other question jumbo, When do keeping the OEM MAF connected together with a MAP sensor and the Haltech.....would that be a problem you think or heard....?
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Honestly Ray - I have no idea if the DC headers would work. I have to believe they would work at least for a while, but might be prone to cracking just like any other header that is too thin or not welded up perfectly. The turbo manifold sees more heat than NA headers would.

I have not heard about problems using the MAF with Haltech. I don't have any experience either, so you might want to try the 350Z forums since they have so many more FI applications than we do.
 
I hope that quote contains the Burns SS collectors. I prefer them myself. It'll be expensive, but well worth it if done correctly. If not, they will fail. From what I understand they are pretty good at the fabrication part wen it comes to exhaust manifolds, exhausts, custom intakes, etc. He wanted to build a CAI for my 45 and showed me some of his "one off" intakes. Can the G35/350Z after market manifolds be used (sorry unfamiliar with the differences/similarities). If so then there are plenty of aftermarket solutions out there.
 
SexualChocolate said:
I hope that quote contains the Burns SS collectors. I prefer them myself. It'll be expensive, but well worth it if done correctly. If not, they will fail. From what I understand they are pretty good at the fabrication part wen it comes to exhaust manifolds, exhausts, custom intakes, etc. He wanted to build a CAI for my 45 and showed me some of his "one off" intakes. Can the G35/350Z after market manifolds be used (sorry unfamiliar with the differences/similarities). If so then there are plenty of aftermarket solutions out there.
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Yes, aftermarket turbo manifolds could be used - but I have a custom installation so none of them would fit without re-fabricating the hot side. Most of the aftermarket manifolds are build for a particular kit - they are not shaped like our OEM manifold.

The configuration of my set-up uses the OEM mating specification so it's either an OEM manifold, an of the shelf header or a custom job. I'd just prefer the OEM manifolds since I already have an extra set.
 
jumbosrule said:
John - outside of a complete custom fab, what other options do I have? Just go for a good set of headers?
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dude, you already know that I'm an all or nothing kind of guy, so I'm very hesitant to really giving my gut advice here. suffice it to say that I think that changing anything now would probably necessitate changing a lot more than just one thing. for example if you did try to substitute a set of headers then I think your up & down pipes will no longer fit, so I kind of don't know what to advise short of just stating "what's done is done."

at this point you may just have to stick with the thing as it is already laid out, unless you wanted to go through some major changes which might amount to almost doing the whole thing over, which I will not advise here at all just to not be a jerk :) only you can decide what route to take now, the assumption of lightning not hitting twice may be a good one to go by in this case, but I'd still be a little worried that the chances of another issue may just be less than the chances of a lightning strike... I just don't like to take chances personally, which is why my own project is being redone, but I'm not saying that's the most sane route to take either... whatever you decide I wish you the best of luck & really hope it turns out for the best... if you did say that you wanted to redo it all then I'd be full of advice :tongue (2):
 
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