modified struts & suspension

slight because of the rear shocks not having enough damper but I do not regret it as lowering is the way to go look at turbocad's post and read it. it will explain what i am talking about.
 
stock rear shocks are kinda long, if you lower much more than like a stock H&R drop your going to start hitting the end of travel & hit the bump stop which is the shock bottoming, sometimes harsh, so a big hard bump will hammer the frame of the car as the suspension goes from what ever your spring rate normally would be straight to infinty when it's bottomed, no more suspension at that point, bang

the idea is for a suspension to absorb the impact, to go lower you need to shorten the rear shock by replacing with a shorter one or you'll run out of travel, but you can gain almost 1/2" in the stock setup though just by shortening the upper shock mount by one of the 2 bushings there

to go really low in the front & still maintain full suspension you also need to take some length out of the front strut too. this coilover setup I'm doing is reducing the front strut length by ~1 3/4", this is ideal for a lowered fx. this means that even at a whole 3" suspension drop the effective lowering to the strut is only 1 1/4" which still leaves plenty of travel without bottoming.

this is actually one of the cool things about the original strut mod that pelon & alan also already did. it lowers the car without robbing travel, it's really a great way to get at least another 3/4" of totally wasted height out of the fx. honestly that mod alone is probably all most fx owners would ever really want or need. height wise it'll get you to around 75% there, this coilover is just to go beyond that & past those limits :tongue:

right now I'm as low as I can go really on stock struts without killing the ride & starting to jackhammer & I have about a 1" tire gap. coilovers are one of the only ways to really get down even lower & even get down to even no tire gap, not one finger or 2 fingers or 3, but none, tire at the wheel opening level dead flush to the tread. too low? then maybe raise it to 1/4", 3/8? maybe even 1/2".... the only limit should be tire contact & at tire contact is really the point of as low as you can go. then bump stop should be set right before tire contact, ideal suspension.


the stiffer you're willing to run your suspension then the lower you can reasonabally ride at, but even at a comfortable rate you can go pretty low as long as your wheels allow it.


is it worth doing these coilovers just to be able to get that last 1/2"-3/4" out of it though? maybe not, but the coilovers bring more to the table than just being able to get a little extra drop.


assuming the correct spring rate is chosen then the ride should be every bit as good as my now 1/2 coil cut H&R springs, but, don't dismiss the upgrade from a stock/kyb strut to a $300 koni strut cartridge at each wheel,... the stock struts as well as replacement kybs use about $5 worth of internals, they are the same guts as a $17 throw away shock has, the overall performance is no measure up against something like a top of the line koni or a bilstien.


when the koni's are first installed they should be set to there lowest settings on both compression & rebound... at this point they should be pretty soft, probably similar to a stock strut or a kyb or so, but then you can adjust from there depending on the spring rate you chose... even at the soft settings equal to a stock strut though the koni's will still be a much better dampener than the cheapo stock or kyb's could ever hope to be, really it don't get much better than a high end koni or bilstien when it comes to suspension dampening, a major upgrade & very worthy of the work involved. it is also possible to do these front koni's with the stock big bucket spring too, that combined with the strut mod would be very nice too, that was my original plan but adding a threaded suspension was the logical next step...


I just cut one strut housing down to see how everything fits togeather & check that everything is correct for each other, everything is perfect. the strut housing still needs to be cut down another 1 1/2" & then the tube needs to be reamed & tapped for the nut that holds the strut in the cartridge. I will weld a stop in at the bottom of the 7" threaded collar on the strut tube which will also have the sway bar eye welded to it, my sway bar links are already shortened for this. 7" of threaded collar is good for the fx to give more than enough versatility to dial in the right spring & right hieght. I ordered a 10" long 400lb spring for setup & initial testing as a starting point.


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amazing r/d as usual John!

I am very happy with my setup since my offset is so aggressive I really dont need to go lower. I had a packed FX again this weekend (Mammoth Trip) and I had about 1 finger gap at the rear and it never scraped (I have my fenders rolled). To top that off I have the "stock" H&R spring and ride :tup:
 
Again need to be on line more often as i really miss out on these mods. Great work sofar John.....!! Looks prommising...:tup:
Now i do know you are a guy that really would like to try out many thing all by himself, but sometimes a solution can be closer then you think.

There is a coilover available outter the appolo. The Japanese firm offers it:

here is the website: http://www.rs-r.co.jp/products/shock/index.php#

And the catalogue: http://www.rs-r.co.jp/download/catalog/shock.pdf

But seeing that there are quit some guys willing to lower their FX i need to update my topic on a possible group buy from KW a bit more a gues.

Check this out: ///3893

I know that i can talk true with KW not wanting to kill the ride with a coilover. They have set's on the market wich i aspecially made for comfort as well.
I it would be custom they probabaly would use there Variant 3 schock wich has bound and rebound adjustment not being that comfortable, but i can always ask :wub:
 
ray, I've seen the apollo's of course, & the HKS... also seen those rs r's before too. reason I'm building them myself is I want total control of selecting my own components & getting them right for my fx, I'd hate to get a cheap set of apollo's & then find out they ride like crap & not be able to do anything about it, or spend double & get a suposedly better setup & still not be happy with it & not be able to do anything about either.

koni & bilsien's are the best in the industry, hard to go wrong with a koni yellow dual adjustable touring sedan cartridge... & then worse case they could also be sent to koni for a nominal fee & be revalved too if needed, but they should be sweet as is. there is almost no way a manufactured coilover kit could be better really... there not going to use the best strut inserts available, there going to use there own stuff to keep there costs down, or source an independant shock manufacturer, but very hard to compete with a company like koni for consistency & qualitty..., most coilovers are built more for price than ultimate quality

then I also can choose my own spring & not have to settle for whatever cheaper spring's the coilover manufacturer spec'd, I can go with something like a really good hypercoil ... I have control of everything, ride height center, travel & limit, things that would otherwise be determined by the coilover builder I get to spec myself. if I knew there was a great setup that was going to be what I want then that'd be great, but if I'm going to spend a few grand anyway I'd rather know that I'm going to be able to get the ride I want & if it's not the ride I want, be able to do something about it & work towards the ride I want rather than just being stuck with what I got...


I haven't finished up the struts, haven't touched them since these test fits. need to do a liitle more cutting then bring them to the machine shop for the boring & threading of the tubes.
 
Nice work John. That's amazing. You should help Infiniti to build the next gen of the FX. :wink:. You've been engineering and research a lot of thing that infiniti missed out for the FX. Keep us updated. :tup:
 
well the new fx has a much better suited front suspension for a vehicle like this & uses a double a arm front suspension. the McPherson strut setup they used on the first gen fx is not really the best design for a top heavy vehicle with a lot of body roll. the difference is in the camber curve... the McPherson front suspension pretty much maintains it's camber throughout it's stroke, not much of a camber curve there at all. this is why when you lower a first gen fx the front suspension doesn't pose any alignment issues but the rear does... the newer fx will see alignment issues in the front at bigger drops just like the first gen fx does in the rear though, so it's kind of a double edged sword... to lower the first gen fx you can go as low as you like in the front without geometry problems but also without the best geometry for the job either , where the new fx will have a much better geometry at it's designed ride height but will pose a problem as it is lowered a lot & the roll center changes because of it...

a new fx at big drops, the front would probably need a geometry correction like what I did in the rear to return a proper camber curve, unless the drop is done through a lowering spindle instead of a lowering spring. at bigger drops adjustable control arms would help, like the g's & stuff have to use..

this is why if you notice, the first gen fx wheel alignment specs are just crazy... they actually spec it as anywhere from 0deg camber all the way up to 1.5deg camber as being within spec... this is kind of crazy & erratic... basically what there telling you with this is that the alignment can be done anywhere from tuned to non aggressive hwy driving (closer to that 0deg) all the way up to more aggressive cornering (closer to that 1.5deg) & all still be within spec, where the newer fx will probably have a much less range of "within spec" because it has a geometry curve built in... this means that at static ride the wheels can be closer to the 0deg, which Will give you better more even tire wear at hwy driving, but then as the body rolls the wheel will then increase camber & go closer to something like 1.5deg or better, also giving you handling through the twisties...

the first gen fx front suspension is a compromise, only good that comes from it is you can drop as much as you want without much issue, but when aligning you have to choose between performance align (closer to the 1.5deg spec) which will make the insides of the tires wear faster under normal driving or a conservative hwy alignment(closer to the 0deg spec), which will cause excess outer tire wear as you push it harder through the turns... most wheel alignment places don't even realize this & just think that anywhere in that window is within "spec" but the spec is so wide... to make matters worse, infiniti doesn't even give you any real adjustment here either, so most alignment places are just going to look for within spec. the biggest mistake most could make is to have a large difference between the left & right but still have them fall within spec & think this is ok... ideally you should use camber bolts in the front to fine tune this & even out both sides & then also be able to tune for more aggressive driving or conservative... most of course just settle for wherever it happens to be as long as it's "within spec"
 
John, the CAMBER is not what creates massive tire wear, it's the toe. I've ran tires close to 40k miles (rated at 36k or so) with 2 degrees of camber on the street and 1/8 toe out. Since the car hardly sees the street now it's around 3-3.5 degrees of camber with 1/8 out but still no uneven wear on the outer edge
 
turbocad6 said:
ray, I've seen the apollo's of course, & the HKS... also seen those rs r's before too. reason I'm building them myself is I want total control of selecting my own components & getting them right for my fx, I'd hate to get a cheap set of apollo's & then find out they ride like crap & not be able to do anything about it, or spend double & get a suposedly better setup & still not be happy with it & not be able to do anything about either.

koni & bilsien's are the best in the industry, hard to go wrong with a koni yellow dual adjustable touring sedan cartridge... & then worse case they could also be sent to koni for a nominal fee & be revalved too if needed, but they should be sweet as is. there is almost no way a manufactured coilover kit could be better really... there not going to use the best strut inserts available, there going to use there own stuff to keep there costs down, or source an independant shock manufacturer, but very hard to compete with a company like koni for consistency & qualitty..., most coilovers are built more for price than ultimate quality

then I also can choose my own spring & not have to settle for whatever cheaper spring's the coilover manufacturer spec'd, I can go with something like a really good hypercoil ... I have control of everything, ride height center, travel & limit, things that would otherwise be determined by the coilover builder I get to spec myself. if I knew there was a great setup that was going to be what I want then that'd be great, but if I'm going to spend a few grand anyway I'd rather know that I'm going to be able to get the ride I want & if it's not the ride I want, be able to do something about it & work towards the ride I want rather than just being stuck with what I got...


I haven't finished up the struts, haven't touched them since these test fits. need to do a liitle more cutting then bring them to the machine shop for the boring & threading of the tubes.
Click to expand...

Know what you mean buddy....!! You are one of those guys who really digs into these things and can do it himself too :tup:
Did HKS had something for the FX....?? I had contact with rookie about this prior and he told me that the Murano kit wich was available was oo short at the rear.
HKS if available wouldn't be that bad IMO as well.

But for any future use for other people check out this website: http://www.kw-suspension.com/us/

This german firm usses several extern coilmanufactures for there 3 variants:

V1 with ALKO Coils

V2 with Yellow Koni Coils

V3 with special customs own made coils withrace technoligee
 
Now i'll bump it after another couple of years.....have been trying to read the most important thing but dang there is a lot of text wich goes way to deep and technical for my patience LOL. Now i'n running the BC coilover kit right now so the whole strut thing isn't what i'm interested in but i'n max'd out at the rear and my camber ( even with Spl camber bolts) is still 2,2 minutes negative.
Today i had a clients FX here and borrowed a 350Z Tie Bar he had from him just to check if its the same and it is so that's compatible.....something wich Jumbo was looking into earlier as well i read. But the Camber Arm is different from the Z's But i remember seeing Rookie made one custom.....Thing is our schock is mounted in like a complete arm and the Z has a different thing going on there. I cannot seem to find that picture and keep wondering how he altered that suspension there. Need to adjust my camber for both performance.....tyre wear and stance as well so looking into this again.

Also i read our rear subframe is different but when i look to the oem spec sheets it show both the same part numbers from a Z as from our FX........anyone...??
 
350Z Subframe 55400-CD02A
FX Subreame 55400-CM81B

They have different part numbers
I beleive the bushing in the back where the diff hangs is a different size ( Not sure about this )
Iand i would think our subframe is wider. Remember when people would mod 350/G35 GTSpec bars to fit the FX
 
Jup your right didn't look at the original nissan/infiniti doucuments just a Nissan parts company on line who i thought showed the oem manufacturer sheets. Still don't figure out the configuration rookie did with the camber bar at the rear.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn GT-I9505 met
 
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